Amazon Allowing Customers to Steal Merchandise


#137

Again your quoting the buyer help files not the seller policies.

We are not buyers. We follow seller policies.

Sellers are required to have a return policy that must match or be more generous than amazon’s. If amazon’s is extended during the holidays yours is required to be also.

“The Amazon Extended Holiday Return Policy requires that orders shipped between November 1 and December 31 be returnable through January 31 of the following year. This policy includes orders that are shipped by you and orders that are shipped by Amazon.”


#138

Wrong!

So because FBA allows returns on a regular basis well past 30 days(sometimes even 60 days), that means sellers have to allow for more than 30 days as well and upwards of 60 days? WRONG!!!

Wrong wrong wrong.


#139

No because that is just amazon, at it’s own discretion being more generous than their policy. By using FBA you agree to allow them to do that.


#140

Read the very fist line here,

https://sellercentral.amazon.com/gp/help/200364110

“When you process returns, you are required to match or exceed the Amazon return policies.


#141

Until recently, this has been the case for me. Lately, no. Same for similar issues.

This isn’t customer damage, it’s utter destruction. And once again, this is an area where they used to cover things like this - if an item was returned clearly broken, we’d be covered.
We finally spoke to a supervisor, they explained that it was due to the return reason of “defective”. They said that if the customer selects this, then they can’t do anything, no matter what the customer sends back. I’m guessing that this is a relatively new policy, and explains why we’re not getting things taken care of lately.
And as for the FB bot, this can be a huge problem now, especially since they made it so that we receive only a fraction of the FB that we used to. We receive maybe 70 a year now (vs 300), so a couple of negs can put your account at risk. One or two more of these - which is VERY likely to happen, given the error rate at the FCs, I’m genuinely fearful that we might lose the buy box get suspended because of our FB score being too low. Either one would be devastating, and not due to anything that we’ve done wrong.


#142

You are misunderstanding this. They “may vary” does not mean a seller is allowed to have a policy of 15 day returns. It means the opposite. A seller could have a policy of 180 day returns.

They certainly CAN. Just because you’ve gotten away with violating a written Amazon policy every year for a long time doesn’t make you right.

The Amazon Extended Holiday Return Policy requires that orders shipped between November 1 and December 31 be returnable through January 31 of the following year. This policy includes orders that are shipped by you and orders that are shipped by Amazon.

And as a reminder:

To ensure a consistent experience for buyers, you must match or exceed Amazon’s return policies.

And

Return policies

Amazon sellers subject to the Business Solutions Agreement for the Selling on Amazon Service are required to have return policies that are at least as favorable as the Amazon return policies. You can see your applicable returns policies on your Returns tab.

And the policy states:

S-2.2 Cancellations, Returns, and Refunds. The Amazon Refund Policies for the applicable Amazon Site will apply to Your Products. Subject to Section F-6, for any of Your Products fulfilled using Fulfillment by Amazon, you will promptly accept, calculate, and process cancellations, returns, refunds, and adjustments in accordance with this Agreement and the Amazon Refund Policies for the applicable Amazon Site, using functionality we enable for your account.

Note: I want to clarify. This Associate referred to the Retail Help Pages, where we say “While most sellers offer a returns policy equivalent to Amazon.com ’s, some seller returns policies may vary.” To clarify, all sellers who sell under the Professional or the Individual selling plans are required to adhere to the Extended Holiday Return Policy.

@abescotti run your business how you want but it’s very clear to me that you are wrong and you haven’t provided any citations to support your claim except that you’ve been getting away with screwing customers on their holiday returns for years.


#143

FWIW Personally I find automated feedback requests messages are good at increasing feedback left percents.

Note though there are no requirements for feedback percents. I think you are likely referring to the Order Defect Rate but this includes all orders regardless of if feedback is left so at least this percent would not be impacted by how many feedbacks you get, just that negative feedback causes an order defect.

To me there really isn’t a distinction as I understand the written policies but of course in the past they may have been making a distinction for our benefit. Fortunately I see virtually no customer damage/destruction that isn’t remedied by the manufacturer warranty so don’t have to deal with this much.


#144

There actually is one. Remember, it has to be returned in a similar condition. An item returned without a box or a damaged box is “customer damaged”. Even a used item would be considered damaged, so long as it’s not overdone. But something that the customer breaks, destroys, etc is a totally different condition. There is simply no cause whatsoever to return an item which was eaten by one’s dog. That is clear negligence on the part of the customer. Nor would any manufacturer that I work with cover that as a warranty - yours must be ultra generous. I am not able to warranty most returned items, not unless there is a clear defect, or if the manufacturer has some sort of happiness guarantee. But even in that case, destroyed by dog would not apply, nor would I ever consider asking.


#145

I sincerely appreciate the links you post, that I am fully aware of.

However, I find it amusing how you do not comment on both seller and buyer help files on the same topic, not matching one another. In fact, they are completely opposite.

Seller help file says you do, the buyer help file says you do not.

We’ve been shipping orders via FBM for over 10 years, and still to this day, we have never been forced to match the FBA extended returns policy.

So you can provide all the links you want to, I am here to let you know, regardless of what you see, a sellers return policy (FBM) does not have to adhere to an amazon FBA extended return policy. (which buyers are fully aware of)

Why Amazon has contradicting verbiage written in their help files for sellers and buyers, I do not know. But I do know, they will not force you to adhere to the FBA ERP when shipping via FBM.

PS. amazons return policy (FBA) does not charge restocking fees. So an FBM seller who charges a restocking fee for returns, clearly, is not “matching or exceeding the Amazon return policies”. Yet for so many years, FBM sellers are allowed to charge it because it is in the FBM sellers return policy.


#146

I just don’t generally get items back that show signs of physical damage. Out of 6.2 million in sales I think I still only have two units with physical damage that prevented me from reselling/warrantying.

I get the distinction you are making but to me “customer damaged” is so vague that in the context of FBA reimbursements I understand it to have meant that if the customer actually does return the product regardless of what condition it is in you can’t get reimbursed. It’s great that Amazon had been covering you in the case of extreme return abuse previously.


#147

Another reason why I’m selling off the rest of my inventory and leaving Amazon to focus on making money in other ways. Amazon refunded 10 customers in the last 60 days and not a single one of those customers “BAD BUYERS” had to return our product… Me and my wife value honesty, integrity, friendship, trust, and business relationships. We are so sick and tired of Amazon mistreating us, using us, and allowing others to abuse us that we have realized that happiness means more to us than stressfully making money with a shady business that mistreats employees and seller’s.


#148

Same-thing happen to us!

As we are doing the same!

This place is a mess. Needs a real deep cleaning before it becomes great again.

And to think there are FBM sellers here who think Amazon will force those FBM sellers to extended their returns period well past 30 days. That’s a joke! I can see FBA, but not FBM. My return policy is 30-days. And that’s that! And that has been working for us for well over 10 years.

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. The amount of ignorance in this forum and on this platform is astounding!


#149

PS the Amazon.com return policy does have provisions for restocking fees.

I find it amusing that you seem to think because the buyer help file says a seller return policy “may vary” that this variation allows a seller to have a much worse return policy when the seller help policy and moderators make clear that

The reality is they are not opposite so no idea why you think they are.

That’s great for you but really crummy for all your customers. Hopefully your willingness to complete ignore written policies continues to work for you and you don’t get suspended.

I hope when you are saying that you are looking in the mirror…

If you are leaving then why are you still posting here?


#150

It’s not really my distinction, it’s one that Amazon has stated in it’s policies. And no, we don’t often see many of these, but it DOES happen. And with this, the supervisor stated that they normally would cover this, but cannot do so in this case BECAUSE THE BUYER CLAIMED THAT THE ITEM WAS DEFECTIVE. My big worry here is that this creates a hole big enough to drive a supertanker through - say the magic word, return ANYTHING for a full refund, no matter how negligent you’ve been (or even if it’s the same item at all).


#151

One return I had gotten back from doing a removal order on had foot prints all over the goose down comforter and was tapped up in a roll with packaging tape without the plastic zip up packaging it came with and inside a cardboard box with holes and rips all over the cardboard. The customer return reason was “NOT AS DESCRIBED IN WEBSITE” disposition was “NOT SOFT, CRUNCHY FEELING” and then 10 buyers got 10 free SodaStream’s and asked for a refund and got to keep them because Amazon doesn’t except returns of C02 cartridges because it’s hazmat so there goes a couple grand there, or then we get the infamous item is defective, get the product back and looks like it’s been thrown out of a airplane on to concrete or it just hasn’t been opened and used or even touched at all. Then sometimes we wait the 45 days allowed for an FBA return to get refunded and just don’t get the refund till the last day or don’t get one at all or the item never gets returned. We sold hundreds of high dollar items in the last 12 months and never had 1 dang review from a customer either. Some people don’t care about the bull crap or abuse or the stress or anger but I do and my wife does and we have been so much happier, healthier, and more cheerful now that we stopped buying and restocking inventory. The quality of our life has drastically improved to the point where now we are focusing on moving to Houston Texas from Minnesota :pray::cowboy_hat_face::slightly_smiling_face:


#152

Because we are sellers, buyer help files are irrelevant.

I’m not aware there is a “policy” that says no restocking fee. Maybe you can link to it? The general FBA policy is that you allow amazon to handle all aspects of the order in any way they see fit.

You are correct, seller policy does say that you can charge restocking fees.


#153

Can you cite where the policy distinction with regards to reimbursements is stated between “customer damaged” and super abused customer damage?

It’s always been my expectation that Amazon doesn’t actually trust the customer return reason as they fully know customers lie to get a free return. Hence why they’ve regularly put “defective” returns back into sellable inventory. So I really hope their internal policies aren’t now relying on it to determine eligibility of a reimbursement :confused:


#154

My apologies. I misunderstood.


#155

Because obviously I haven’t left selling on amazon yet. Still waiting on my warehouse lease contract to come back approved by the property manager, so we can get out of a 4 year lease contract early.
This entire process is not fun. On thin ice. I bet the millions in sales you do here on amazon make you feel on top of the world, and some have been there before as well. Let it be known, nothing is guaranteed here on amazon! Tread lightly little gal, Drive slow, pump ya brakes, be humble!

And, I also do not need your help finding the exit door on amazon either.

PS. The way you speak to people here on the forums reminds me of why I stopped responding and following you a long time ago. You remind me a lot of funkmonkey for some reason.
I’m not fond of your attitude in reply’s to other sellers here either.

I shall resort to previous. And, I yield back.


#156

Dear Friend,

I wish you the best of luck for you and your wife!
Life is much better with less stress and constant loss of money. Retail in B&M and Retail in eCommerce is not easy by any means.

It has been long-awaited for the day we leave this marketplace! Not something we ever looked forward to either. It has also been so much fun in the 10+ years we have been here. A lot of work but totally worth it. The last two years have been a complete disaster and losses across the board and 75% decreases in revenue. No seller support anymore for pro seller accounts. Just a ridiculous place to sell now. Such a shame too, this place could be great if minor tweaks were made a reality by competent individuals with authority in amazons corporate structure.